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Should Black lives matter to me anymore?

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Should Black lives matter to me anymore?
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nemesissUser avatarPosts: 1259Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2009 7:29 pm

Post Should Black lives matter to me anymore?

When you care about people being treated as equals, regardless of skin-color.... some things you make it really hard.
I'm no expert on the social behaviour of people in the united states, and I'm willing to give the benefit of doubt when they say that black people are not being treated as equals...
But then again...

The hash tag #FuckParis

Harassing people in a library
http://www.mediaite.com/online/dartmout ... hite-fcks/

Sending (fake) threats via twitter to you own movement
http://www.crimemagazine.com/blacklives ... ents-photo

Celebrating a Black cop being killed
http://www.allenbwest.com/2015/10/black ... s-volumes/

A change.org petition where Adele has to publicly admit white privilege
https://www.change.org/p/billboard-potu ... -privilege


These kinds of articles, makes it harder for me to believe that African Americans are indeed treated unequal.
And if it still true, then they only make it harder for people to address the issue.
But what are your thoughts on this? (I apologize for the click-bait title)
Wed Dec 09, 2015 4:44 pm
Gnug215ModeratorUser avatarPosts: 2544Joined: Sat Feb 21, 2009 10:31 pm

Post Re: Should Black lives matter to me anymore?

nemesiss wrote:When you care about people being treated as equals, regardless of skin-color.... some things you make it really hard.
I'm no expert on the social behaviour of people in the united states, and I'm willing to give the benefit of doubt when they say that black people are not being treated as equals...
But then again...

The hash tag #FuckParis

Harassing people in a library
http://www.mediaite.com/online/dartmout ... hite-fcks/

Sending (fake) threats via twitter to you own movement
http://www.crimemagazine.com/blacklives ... ents-photo

Celebrating a Black cop being killed
http://www.allenbwest.com/2015/10/black ... s-volumes/

A change.org petition where Adele has to publicly admit white privilege
https://www.change.org/p/billboard-potu ... -privilege


These kinds of articles, makes it harder for me to believe that African Americans are indeed treated unequal.
And if it still true, then they only make it harder for people to address the issue.
But what are your thoughts on this? (I apologize for the click-bait title)



Well... certainly, these cases makes it hard to care for the BLM movement. (Although that last one seems like straight up trolling by someone...)

But...

These kinds of articles, makes it harder for me to believe that African Americans are indeed treated unequal.


I don't see how you come to that conclusion, based on the links you made.

The two things don't even seem connected. Sure, that one link about the fake bomb threats made it seem like they had to invent fake bomb threats to make it look like blacks were being threatened, but that is just one single case where someone did something stupid.
That's like using a single anecdote to make a point.

If you're actually interested, I suggest you look up some real statistics on the matter.

For one, you could start with the proportion of the prision population, and work your way from there, to find the causes of the stats.
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Wed Dec 09, 2015 5:27 pm
LaurensSocial EditorUser avatarPosts: 2950Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2010 11:24 pmLocation: Norwich UK Gender: Male

Post Re: Should Black lives matter to me anymore?

nemesiss wrote:When you care about people being treated as equals, regardless of skin-color.... some things you make it really hard.
I'm no expert on the social behaviour of people in the united states, and I'm willing to give the benefit of doubt when they say that black people are not being treated as equals...
But then again...

The hash tag #FuckParis

Harassing people in a library
http://www.mediaite.com/online/dartmout ... hite-fcks/

Sending (fake) threats via twitter to you own movement
http://www.crimemagazine.com/blacklives ... ents-photo

Celebrating a Black cop being killed
http://www.allenbwest.com/2015/10/black ... s-volumes/

A change.org petition where Adele has to publicly admit white privilege
https://www.change.org/p/billboard-potu ... -privilege


These kinds of articles, makes it harder for me to believe that African Americans are indeed treated unequal.
And if it still true, then they only make it harder for people to address the issue.
But what are your thoughts on this? (I apologize for the click-bait title)


I don't see how you get to that conclusion from those articles.

Speaking for the UK black people are far more likely to get stopped and searched by police. Also more black people go to court for possession than white people. A fact that doesn't reflect the actual demographic of people using drugs.

If that is not being treated unequal, I don't know what is.
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Wed Dec 09, 2015 7:43 pm
he_who_is_nobodyBloggerUser avatarPosts: 3304Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2009 1:36 amLocation: Albuquerque, New Mexico Gender: Male

Post Re: Should Black lives matter to me anymore?

This is the same thing you did in the feminism thread. Give me a half hour and I could find pretty much the same thing for atheism, skepticism, humanism, or any other movement. People are stupid and make mistakes all the time under the banner of every and any social group. Do the actions of the few involved in a movement taint the entirety of a movement?

Let us get to the facts. Police officers are far more likely to target blacks and other minorities than whites and those same minorities are far more likely to go to jail and be sentenced for far longer. The Black Lives Matter movement is trying to address that through different ways. Some of those ways are great and could work; others are dumb. However, that is the case for all movements. There is no perfect solution for an issue like this.

Thus, the real question is, do a few bad apples spoil the bunch for you? In addition, do the actions of some in the Black Lives Matter movement nullify the statistics that should be addressed?
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Wed Dec 09, 2015 8:03 pm
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thenexttodiePosts: 751Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 7:59 pm Gender: Male

Post Re: Should Black lives matter to me anymore?

nemesiss wrote:When you care about people being treated as equals, regardless of skin-color.... some things you make it really hard.
I'm no expert on the social behaviour of people in the united states, and I'm willing to give the benefit of doubt when they say that black people are not being treated as equals...
But then again...

The hash tag #FuckParis

Harassing people in a library
http://www.mediaite.com/online/dartmout ... hite-fcks/

Sending (fake) threats via twitter to you own movement
http://www.crimemagazine.com/blacklives ... ents-photo

Celebrating a Black cop being killed
http://www.allenbwest.com/2015/10/black ... s-volumes/

A change.org petition where Adele has to publicly admit white privilege
https://www.change.org/p/billboard-potu ... -privilege


These kinds of articles, makes it harder for me to believe that African Americans are indeed treated unequal.
And if it still true, then they only make it harder for people to address the issue.
But what are your thoughts on this? (I apologize for the click-bait title)


The links you have provided accurately portray the mindset of those in the Black Lives Matter movement. Sadly.
“..the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him.” Tolstoy
Wed Jan 06, 2016 8:22 pm
he_who_is_nobodyBloggerUser avatarPosts: 3304Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2009 1:36 amLocation: Albuquerque, New Mexico Gender: Male

Post Re: Should Black lives matter to me anymore?

thenexttodie wrote:
nemesiss wrote:When you care about people being treated as equals, regardless of skin-color.... some things you make it really hard.
I'm no expert on the social behaviour of people in the united states, and I'm willing to give the benefit of doubt when they say that black people are not being treated as equals...
But then again...

The hash tag #FuckParis

Harassing people in a library
http://www.mediaite.com/online/dartmout ... hite-fcks/

Sending (fake) threats via twitter to you own movement
http://www.crimemagazine.com/blacklives ... ents-photo

Celebrating a Black cop being killed
http://www.allenbwest.com/2015/10/black ... s-volumes/

A change.org petition where Adele has to publicly admit white privilege
https://www.change.org/p/billboard-potu ... -privilege


These kinds of articles, makes it harder for me to believe that African Americans are indeed treated unequal.
And if it still true, then they only make it harder for people to address the issue.
But what are your thoughts on this? (I apologize for the click-bait title)


The links you have provided accurately portray the mindset of those in the Black Lives Matter movement. Sadly.


Amazing to find that out. You see, my wife and I are both in the Black Lives Matter movement, and none of those links reflect our mindset. However, stating opinions as facts is your strong suit, so do not let this little fact slow you down.
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Wed Jan 06, 2016 8:42 pm
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thenexttodiePosts: 751Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 7:59 pm Gender: Male

Post Re: Should Black lives matter to me anymore?

nemesiss wrote:When you care about people being treated as equals, regardless of skin-color.... some things you make it really hard.
I'm no expert on the social behaviour of people in the united states, and I'm willing to give the benefit of doubt when they say that black people are not being treated as equals...
But then again...

The hash tag #FuckParis

Harassing people in a library
http://www.mediaite.com/online/dartmout ... hite-fcks/

Sending (fake) threats via twitter to you own movement
http://www.crimemagazine.com/blacklives ... ents-photo

Celebrating a Black cop being killed
http://www.allenbwest.com/2015/10/black ... s-volumes/

A change.org petition where Adele has to publicly admit white privilege
https://www.change.org/p/billboard-potu ... -privilege


These kinds of articles, makes it harder for me to believe that African Americans are indeed treated unequal.
And if it still true, then they only make it harder for people to address the issue.
But what are your thoughts on this? (I apologize for the click-bait title)


thenexttodie wrote:The links you have provided accurately portray the mindset of those in the Black Lives Matter movement. Sadly.


he_who_is_nobody wrote:Amazing to find that out. You see, my wife and I are both in the Black Lives Matter movement.
Which Black Lives demonstrations did you and your wife organize?
Image
“..the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him.” Tolstoy
Wed Jan 06, 2016 9:53 pm
he_who_is_nobodyBloggerUser avatarPosts: 3304Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2009 1:36 amLocation: Albuquerque, New Mexico Gender: Male

Post Re: Should Black lives matter to me anymore?

thenexttodie wrote:
nemesiss wrote:When you care about people being treated as equals, regardless of skin-color.... some things you make it really hard.
I'm no expert on the social behaviour of people in the united states, and I'm willing to give the benefit of doubt when they say that black people are not being treated as equals...
But then again...

The hash tag #FuckParis

Harassing people in a library
http://www.mediaite.com/online/dartmout ... hite-fcks/

Sending (fake) threats via twitter to you own movement
http://www.crimemagazine.com/blacklives ... ents-photo

Celebrating a Black cop being killed
http://www.allenbwest.com/2015/10/black ... s-volumes/

A change.org petition where Adele has to publicly admit white privilege
https://www.change.org/p/billboard-potu ... -privilege


These kinds of articles, makes it harder for me to believe that African Americans are indeed treated unequal.
And if it still true, then they only make it harder for people to address the issue.
But what are your thoughts on this? (I apologize for the click-bait title)


thenexttodie wrote:The links you have provided accurately portray the mindset of those in the Black Lives Matter movement. Sadly.


he_who_is_nobody wrote:Amazing to find that out. You see, my wife and I are both in the Black Lives Matter movement.
Which Black Lives demonstrations did you and your wife organize?
Image


Zero. Does one have to be an organizer to be apart of it?
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Wed Jan 06, 2016 10:01 pm
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thenexttodiePosts: 751Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 7:59 pm Gender: Male

Post Re: Should Black lives matter to me anymore?

he_who_is_nobody wrote:Zero. Does one have to be an organizer to be apart of it?


No. I just don't believe that your mere existence is enough to show that I am wrong.

Nonetheless I would be interested in hearing your ideas on how we can insure that an equal percentage of members of every racial group are killed by the police every year.
“..the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him.” Tolstoy
Thu Jan 14, 2016 7:55 pm
he_who_is_nobodyBloggerUser avatarPosts: 3304Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2009 1:36 amLocation: Albuquerque, New Mexico Gender: Male

Post Re: Should Black lives matter to me anymore?

thenexttodie wrote:
he_who_is_nobody wrote:Zero. Does one have to be an organizer to be apart of it?


No. I just don't believe that your mere existence is enough to show that I am wrong.

Nonetheless I would be interested in hearing your ideas on how we can insure that an equal percentage of members of every racial group are killed by the police every year.


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Thu Jan 14, 2016 8:59 pm
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thenexttodiePosts: 751Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 7:59 pm Gender: Male

Post Re: Should Black lives matter to me anymore?

Do you believe that socialism is the answer like BLM people do in the pic I posted?
“..the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him.” Tolstoy
Thu Jan 14, 2016 11:46 pm
he_who_is_nobodyBloggerUser avatarPosts: 3304Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2009 1:36 amLocation: Albuquerque, New Mexico Gender: Male

Post Re: Should Black lives matter to me anymore?

thenexttodie wrote:Do you believe that socialism is the answer like BLM people do in the pic I posted?


Image
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Fri Jan 15, 2016 4:25 pm
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thenexttodiePosts: 751Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 7:59 pm Gender: Male

Post Re: Should Black lives matter to me anymore?

So just because you exist, we should not assume my generalization is incorrect?
“..the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him.” Tolstoy
Sun Jan 17, 2016 10:06 pm
thenexttodiePosts: 751Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 7:59 pm Gender: Male

Post Re: Should Black lives matter to me anymore?

[/quote]

I don't see how you get to that conclusion from those articles.

Speaking for the UK black people are far more likely to get stopped and searched by police. Also more black people go to court for possession than white people. A fact that doesn't reflect the actual demographic of people using drugs.

If that is not being treated unequal, I don't know what is.[/quote]

I suspect this all has less to do with treating people equally and more to do with how police become aware of criminal activity and the level of involvement and resources required to arrest different types of criminals who in all practicality are committing the same crime.

I have never seen a white person standing on a street corner selling drugs.
“..the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him.” Tolstoy
Sun Feb 07, 2016 9:13 pm
itsdemtitansBloggerUser avatarPosts: 706Joined: Tue Jun 23, 2015 11:36 pm Gender: Male

Post Re: Should Black lives matter to me anymore?

thenexttodie wrote:I have never seen a white person standing on a street corner selling drugs.


I have. He used to hang out behind my apartment complex for a few weeks, then the cops got him.
Sun Feb 07, 2016 9:19 pm
thenexttodiePosts: 751Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 7:59 pm Gender: Male

Post Re: Should Black lives matter to me anymore?

thenexttodie wrote:I have never seen a white person standing on a street corner selling drugs.


itsdemtitans wrote:[I have. He used to hang out behind my apartment complex for a few weeks, then the cops got him.


Well, there you go. Probably the easiest way for the police to catch someone selling drugs is to catch someone selling them on the street. In the US I would say about 85 to 95 percent of these street dealers are charged with only with "possession".

I have never seen a white street dealer and you say you have seen 1.

To catch a dealer who only sells to drugs to his workmates would probably be close to impossible. Especially in the US. Just to arrest any non-street dealer I think would require an informant or an undercover officer. And that's totally different ballgame. And these are the people who are going to be charged with trafficing and intent to distribute ect. So I am sure you get what I mean.
“..the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him.” Tolstoy
Sun Feb 07, 2016 10:25 pm
LaurensSocial EditorUser avatarPosts: 2950Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2010 11:24 pmLocation: Norwich UK Gender: Male

Post Re: Should Black lives matter to me anymore?

thenexttodie wrote:
I have never seen a white person standing on a street corner selling drugs.


Having had experience buying drugs in my younger days I can say I never was acquainted with anyone selling drugs that wasn't white. Personal experience means fuck all.

Especially when it comes down to racist prejudice such as those you clearly hold, you've probably walked past hundreds of white drug dealers, but haven't made that assumption about them because they are white.

In any case its good to know you're also a racist as well as everything else.
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Wed Feb 17, 2016 7:17 pm
thenexttodiePosts: 751Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 7:59 pm Gender: Male

Post Re: Should Black lives matter to me anymore?

thenexttodie wrote:
I have never seen a white person standing on a street corner selling drugs.


Laurens wrote:Having had experience buying drugs in my younger days I can say I never was acquainted with anyone selling drugs that wasn't white.


You've missed the point. Standing on a street corner selling drugs, is probably the best way to get caught by the police, selling drugs. It doesn't require a higher than normal amount of resources that a normal patrol officer would have, for a law officer or even a civilian to realize "Hey that guy is selling drugs!"


Laurens wrote:Especially when it comes down to racist prejudice such as those you clearly hold, you've probably walked past hundreds of white drug dealers, but haven't made that assumption about them because they are white.

In any case its good to know you're also a racist as well as everything else.


The portal which will allow your mind to exit the box it's trapped inside in, is on the left.
“..the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him.” Tolstoy
Thu Feb 18, 2016 8:35 pm
LaurensSocial EditorUser avatarPosts: 2950Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2010 11:24 pmLocation: Norwich UK Gender: Male

Post Re: Should Black lives matter to me anymore?

thenexttodie wrote:
thenexttodie wrote:
I have never seen a white person standing on a street corner selling drugs.


Laurens wrote:Having had experience buying drugs in my younger days I can say I never was acquainted with anyone selling drugs that wasn't white.


You've missed the point. Standing on a street corner selling drugs, is probably the best way to get caught by the police, selling drugs. It doesn't require a higher than normal amount of resources that a normal patrol officer would have, for a law officer or even a civilian to realize "Hey that guy is selling drugs!"


Laurens wrote:Especially when it comes down to racist prejudice such as those you clearly hold, you've probably walked past hundreds of white drug dealers, but haven't made that assumption about them because they are white.

In any case its good to know you're also a racist as well as everything else.


The portal which will allow your mind to exit the box it's trapped inside in, is on the left.

You're operating on the assumption that there are no white street dealers. There's no basis for that.

The simple truth is that poor black neighbourhoods are subject to higher police harassment. This is evidenced by the disparity between the number of black people stopped on suspicion of drugs vs the demographic of people who actually use them. White people use more drugs yet have to face less stop and searches, less arrests, and lesser punishments.

It's really not the case that black people just get caught more often than white people because they don't know how to be discreet. What we are talking about isn't Street dealers anyway it's innocent black people being subject to unfair police harassment simply because the colour of their skin.
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Fri Feb 19, 2016 8:24 am
thenexttodiePosts: 751Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 7:59 pm Gender: Male

Post Re: Should Black lives matter to me anymore?

You're operating on the assumption that there are no white street dealers. There's no basis for that.
I know there are white street dealers.

In the US, most street dealers are not white. Street dealing territories are controlled by street gangs. Out of 100 or so of the major nationwide gangs in the US, there are only 1 or 2 that readily accept white members. The reason for this is that most of the gangs are run by people who are either in prison or are expected to eventually be in prison where they will not be allowed to associate much with people outside of their race and it just plays out from there. If you are a white person in prison, you are not going to joining the Bloods or the GD's, your going to join a "white power" gang. Thats how it is.



The simple truth is that poor black neighbourhoods are subject to higher police harassment. This is evidenced by the disparity between the number of black people stopped on suspicion of drugs vs...


What is the number of black people who have been harassed by the police? And what is the number for white people? Where do you get these numbers from?
“..the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him.” Tolstoy
Sat Feb 20, 2016 12:47 am
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