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Black lives do matter, but the movement has gone to hell

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Black lives do matter, but the movement has gone to hell
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WarKChat ModeratorUser avatarPosts: 1182Joined: Wed Aug 12, 2009 9:59 am Gender: Tree

Post Re: Black lives do matter, but the movement has gone to hell

thenexttodie wrote:
thenexttodie wrote:Hackenslash, Which part of this video is supposed to show wrongful use of lethal force by the officer?


,
hackenslash wrote: which part of my post is supposed to suggest that that's what I was showing with the video?


The part where you said the officer
totally lost the plot
There is nothing in the video you posted that shows that is the case. I am sure you are smart enough to realize that. Right?


I think this is a slight misunderstanding. As a Christian, thenexttodie thinks it perfectly normal to shoot dead an innocent person without any reason.

As a non-christian, hackenslash finds it absolutely unacceptable and disgraceful.

I hope this clears things a bit.
Did you see that ludicrous display last night?
Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:45 pm
hackenslashLime TordUser avatarPosts: 2353Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2009 3:43 pm Gender: Cake

Post Re: Black lives do matter, but the movement has gone to hell

thenexttodie wrote:The part where you said the officer
totally lost the plot
There is nothing in the video you posted that shows that is the case. I am sure you are smart enough to realize that. Right?


That was a comment about his demeanour, not whether his actions were justified. His demeanour is extremely close to hysteria. That suggests that his training in dealing with such situations is sub-standard.

Whether or not his actions in shooting the guy were justified is a separate question. For the record, by all accounts he wasn't, but that's entirely aside from the point of my post, which is that the officer's ability to deal with tense or escalating situations is pretty much non-existent, whether because he's simply not cop material or his training was utterly shite.

Frankly, this guy would struggle to get a job in a call centre if his ability to deal with tense situations is so shockingly bad.
Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:55 pm
thenexttodiePosts: 799Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 7:59 pm Gender: Male

Post Re: Black lives do matter, but the movement has gone to hell

hackenslash wrote:
That was a comment about his demeanour, not whether his actions were justified. His demeanour is extremely close to hysteria. That suggests that his training in dealing with such situations is sub-standard.

Whether or not his actions in shooting the guy were justified is a separate question. For the record, by all accounts he wasn't, but that's entirely aside from the point of my post, which is that the officer's ability to deal with tense or escalating situations is pretty much non-existent, whether because he's simply not cop material or his training was utterly shite.

Frankly, this guy would struggle to get a job in a call centre if his ability to deal with tense situations is so shockingly bad.


Do you have any evidence that this police officer is racisist?

Do you have any evidence of systematic oppression of black people in the US? Perhaps a law or some form of domestic policy? Because such things were evident during Rosa Park's time. Now they are not. So I disagree with your comparison of Rosa Park to Black Lives Matter activists.
“..the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him.” Tolstoy
Fri Sep 02, 2016 6:50 pm
australopithecusAdministratorUser avatarPosts: 4279Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:27 pmLocation: Kernow Gender: Time Lord

Post Re: Black lives do matter, but the movement has gone to hell

I'm not sure why you've move the goalposts from the officer's clearly panicked demeanour to an accusation of racism that Hack hadn't made.

Maybe address the fact that the officer lost his shit and this is not really ideal in a profession where you literally make life and death decisions first?
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Sat Sep 03, 2016 5:29 pm
thenexttodiePosts: 799Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 7:59 pm Gender: Male

Post Re: Black lives do matter, but the movement has gone to hell

australopithecus wrote:I'm not sure why you've move the goalposts from the officer's clearly panicked demeanour to an accusation of racism that Hack hadn't made.

Maybe address the fact that the officer lost his shit and this is not really ideal in a profession where you literally make life and death decisions first?


I don't believe ever I set any goalposts concerning the demeanor of the officer after the shooting.

As far as the video goes, you hardly even see the officer. He seems to communicate something to other officers which are behind the car. Then yells "Fuck! I told him not to reach for it!". He issues meaningful and correct commands to the passengers, who are extracted safely.

The officer is breathing heavily and seems to be coping with a rush of adranalin.

There is nothing here which shows the offices "losing his shit". And no evidence of any wrongful action made by the police officer.
“..the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him.” Tolstoy
Sun Sep 04, 2016 5:56 pm
thenexttodiePosts: 799Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 7:59 pm Gender: Male

Post Re: Black lives do matter, but the movement has gone to hell

Anyway, again

@ Hackenslash

thenexttodie wrote:Do you have any evidence that this police officer is racist?

Do you have any evidence of systematic oppression of black people in the US? Perhaps a law or some form of domestic policy? Because such things were evident during Rosa Park's time. Now they are not. So I disagree with your comparison of Rosa Park to Black Lives Matter activists.
“..the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him.” Tolstoy
Sun Sep 04, 2016 7:25 pm
australopithecusAdministratorUser avatarPosts: 4279Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:27 pmLocation: Kernow Gender: Time Lord

Post Re: Black lives do matter, but the movement has gone to hell

thenexttodie wrote:
australopithecus wrote:I'm not sure why you've move the goalposts from the officer's clearly panicked demeanour to an accusation of racism that Hack hadn't made.

Maybe address the fact that the officer lost his shit and this is not really ideal in a profession where you literally make life and death decisions first?


I don't believe ever I set any goalposts concerning the demeanor of the officer after the shooting.

As far as the video goes, you hardly even see the officer. He seems to communicate something to other officers which are behind the car. Then yells "Fuck! I told him not to reach for it!". He issues meaningful and correct commands to the passengers, who are extracted safely.

The officer is breathing heavily and seems to be coping with a rush of adranalin.

There is nothing here which shows the offices "losing his shit". And no evidence of any wrongful action made by the police officer.



As someone who routinely suffers anxiety and and panic attacks, and as such is well versed in the symptoms of both, I can confirm that cop completely lost his shit, big time.
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Sun Sep 04, 2016 7:44 pm
thenexttodiePosts: 799Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 7:59 pm Gender: Male

Post Re: Black lives do matter, but the movement has gone to hell

australopithecus wrote:

As someone who routinely suffers anxiety and and panic attacks, and as such is well versed in the symptoms of both, I can confirm that cop completely lost his shit, big time.


What a coinicidence, I actually suffer from anxiety and panic attacks as well. Doctors gave me Lexapro and Valium. Been off the stuff for quite some time now.

Actually I have a reserve pack of Valium in a drawer right across from where Im sitting know which I forgot I even had. It probably has about 8 tiny pills in it. I could write League of reason on it and send you a picture.
“..the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him.” Tolstoy
Sun Sep 04, 2016 8:09 pm
thenexttodiePosts: 799Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 7:59 pm Gender: Male

Post Re: Black lives do matter, but the movement has gone to hell

I can't believe you would resort to such a low tactic. What an embarrassment.
“..the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him.” Tolstoy
Sun Sep 04, 2016 8:21 pm
thenexttodiePosts: 799Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 7:59 pm Gender: Male

Post Re: Black lives do matter, but the movement has gone to hell

I guess all thats left is for me to half heartedly await HnS's reply, which if anything, will probably be something nonsensical like "Oh yeah? Well my uncle drives his car 90,000 miles to work each day. But Eskimos catch 2 fish!!
“..the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him.” Tolstoy
Sun Sep 04, 2016 8:44 pm
MarsCydoniaUser avatarPosts: 827Joined: Fri May 16, 2014 4:15 pm

Post Re: Black lives do matter, but the movement has gone to hell

thenexttodie wrote:I guess all thats left is for me to half heartedly await HnS's reply, which if anything, will probably be something nonsensical like "Oh yeah? Well my uncle drives his car 90,000 miles to work each day. But Eskimos catch 2 fish!!

A sensical reply? That's what I've been waiting for too... but from you.

If you think you've made any sensical point about BLM you may have a deeply distorted sense of self-importance.
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Sun Sep 04, 2016 9:05 pm
Dragan GlasContributorUser avatarPosts: 2954Joined: Mon Dec 14, 2009 1:55 amLocation: Ireland Gender: Male

Post Re: Black lives do matter, but the movement has gone to hell

Greetings,

Having watched the video, I think that this was an extremely unfortunate misunderstanding that could have been prevented - if the officer(s) present had thought more carefully about what they were instructing him to do actually entailed.

I infer that the wallet (with ID and carry permit) was in his right rear pocket - and that, like most people - his weapon was also on his right side of his belt/trousers. In reaching for his rear pocket, his hand would pass by his gun first - giving the impression that he was reaching for it.

Given that, according to his girlfriend, he said he had a weapon - as his hand was moving to his rear pocket - the outcome was all too predictable.

The officer was already on high alert. Hearing that the man had a gun - whilst his hand was already in motion - tipped him over the edge, causing him to fire several times.

It was also sad hearing the little girl, towards the end of the video, trying to comfort her mother by telling her that she was there with her.

Kindest regards,

James
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"The Word of God is the Creation we behold and it is in this Word, which no human invention can counterfeit or alter, that God speaketh universally to man."
The Age Of Reason
Sun Sep 04, 2016 9:10 pm
australopithecusAdministratorUser avatarPosts: 4279Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:27 pmLocation: Kernow Gender: Time Lord

Post Re: Black lives do matter, but the movement has gone to hell

thenexttodie wrote:I can't believe you would resort to such a low tactic. What an embarrassment.


On the list of things I would lose any sleep over, your rehearsed offence would be someone near the bottom of another list that I cared even less about.

"Low tactic"? You mean recognising symptoms of what is clearly an episode of obvious panic and labeling them as such? You're right. I'm worse than Hitler. Woe is me. Drop the righteous indignation act, it fools no one.
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Sun Sep 04, 2016 9:59 pm
hackenslashLime TordUser avatarPosts: 2353Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2009 3:43 pm Gender: Cake

Post Re: Black lives do matter, but the movement has gone to hell

thenexttodie wrote:Do you have any evidence that this police officer is racisist?


Do you have any evidence that I suggested he was? What's this bollocks?

Do you have any evidence of systematic oppression of black people in the US? Perhaps a law or some form of domestic policy? Because such things were evident during Rosa Park's time. Now they are not. So I disagree with your comparison of Rosa Park to Black Lives Matter activists.


Of course you do, dear, for the reasons I outlined in the post you're disagreeing with.
Mon Sep 05, 2016 12:13 am
thenexttodiePosts: 799Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 7:59 pm Gender: Male

Post Re: Black lives do matter, but the movement has gone to hell

Dragan Glas wrote:Greetings,

Having watched the video, I think that this was an extremely unfortunate misunderstanding that could have been prevented - if the officer(s) present had thought more carefully about what they were instructing him to do actually entailed.

I infer that the wallet (with ID and carry permit) was in his right rear pocket - and that, like most people - his weapon was also on his right side of his belt/trousers. In reaching for his rear pocket, his hand would pass by his gun first - giving the impression that he was reaching for it.

Given that, according to his girlfriend, he said he had a weapon - as his hand was moving to his rear pocket - the outcome was all too predictable.

The officer was already on high alert. Hearing that the man had a gun - whilst his hand was already in motion - tipped him over the edge, causing him to fire several times.

It was also sad hearing the little girl, towards the end of the video, trying to comfort her mother by telling her that she was there with her.

Kindest regards,

James


I can understand why you would think this. One thing you might not know is that the reason why Philando Castile (the man who was shot) was pulled over was because he was suspected of being involved in an armed robbery. It's extremely unlikely the officer would have asked him for his ID, auto registration, firearm permit once it was made known that Philando was actually armed.

It's not as if this was a situation police are not trained for. I presume at least 100 people who are armed and licensed to carry are pulled over each day in the US. The first thing out of an officers mouth will never be "Reach into your pocket and give me your ID and permit to carry". This is because it only takes 1 second to grab your pistol and shoot the officer, instead of grabbing your wallet.

I believe Philando at best acted foolishly, and If he actually did have a permit to carry it should have been revoked a long time ago.

If the officer did fuck up, asked for ID and then shot him, after he was aware Philando was armed then this is something which is not only exetremely unlikely, but also something we have no evidence of.
“..the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him.” Tolstoy
Tue Sep 06, 2016 8:11 pm
thenexttodiePosts: 799Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2015 7:59 pm Gender: Male

Post Re: Black lives do matter, but the movement has gone to hell

australopithecus wrote:
On the list of things I would lose any sleep over, your rehearsed offence would be someone near the bottom of another list that I cared even less about.

"Low tactic"? You mean recognising symptoms of what is clearly an episode of obvious panic and labeling them as such? You're right. I'm worse than Hitler. Woe is me. Drop the righteous indignation act, it fools no one.


Right...I am sure you will agree that just because you were diagnosed with a mental defect, by a doctor, that of course we should not presume you are now magically able to diagnose people of the same defect...Right?
“..the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him.” Tolstoy
Wed Sep 14, 2016 5:37 pm
australopithecusAdministratorUser avatarPosts: 4279Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:27 pmLocation: Kernow Gender: Time Lord

Post Re: Black lives do matter, but the movement has gone to hell

You'd have a point if I had actually diagnosed him with anything, but I didn't. I said "he lost his shit, big time", I made no statement about his mental health, I commented that I thought he was clearly having a panic attack. Panic attacks are a symptom of some mental health issues, but are not exclusive to them. Next time reply to what I actually post, not what you imagine I posted.
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Thu Sep 15, 2016 5:27 pm
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