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Questions to Justice Frangi about Noah's flood

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Questions to Justice Frangi about Noah's flood
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IsotelusBloggerUser avatarPosts: 317Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2010 12:59 am Gender: Tree

Post Re: Questions to Justice Frangi about Noah's flood

Justice Frangipane wrote:Hello everyone.

There is a lot going on in this thread that is requiring way more of my time than I have available. With about 15 new questions to answer each day, I need to focus on specific things. That's fine, I enjoy the discussion. But Please be patient with the timeline I have available.

Mountains can form extremely quickly and we have seen islands and mountain ranges form this century due to volcanic activity and earthquakes. A world wide catastrophe would not only be able to create mountains and our current topography, it would be expected to do so.

Polystrate fossils are explained by the strata they are in created by rapid formation due to flood waters. With modern science explaining rapid layer formation and stratification by flood waters, there is logical to think that this could have happened on a much larger scale.

I, of course, do not have all the answers, but I do think that there is a possibility that this is what happened. And it should not be ruled out as an option.

There are many aspects to the theory of a Godless creation that leave questions unanswered. (origins of life, matter, space, time, laws, energy...)

While I won't pretend to have all the answers I do think that this is a reasonable consideration.


No worries about your timeline. We all understand.

I'm going to focus on the last couple of points. What mountain ranges have formed during the last century? That sure is news to me.

Back to the polystrate fossils, I don't know if you realize that there are soil horizons between many of the layers, meaning that for a time the water levels actually subsided before rising again, which implies smaller seasonal flooding. You simply cannot conflate any reference of seasonal and/or local flooding in the geological record to a giant global flood.
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Mon Feb 24, 2014 10:17 pm
he_who_is_nobodyBloggerUser avatarPosts: 3222Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2009 1:36 amLocation: Albuquerque, New Mexico Gender: Male

Post Re: Questions to Justice Frangi about Noah's flood

Justice Frangipane wrote:There are many aspects to the theory of a Godless creation that leave questions unanswered. (origins of life, matter, space, time, laws, energy...)


Whether or not godless creation can answer those questions (and you would be surprised with how many we could answer and how many we are on the cusp of answering) is beside the point. Saying GodDidIt is not an answer by any means. That would, at best, move the answers to the questions one more step. In other words, you are the one unable to answer those questions.
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fightofthejellyfishUser avatarPosts: 62Joined: Mon May 17, 2010 5:34 amLocation: Australia Gender: Male

Post Re: Questions to Justice Frangi about Noah's flood

Justice Frangipane wrote:If you spray water into a fire (as a firefighter would do to extinguish a fire) you would have water to steam conversion along the outsides of the channel of water, and you would have cool water in the center hitting the fire. If a large Ice meteor hit the atmosphere, yes, some would convert to steam releasing heat. Other parts would pass through and stay frozen.
"some would convert to steam releasing heat." No. Converting to steam would absorb heat - it requires energy to warm something up. With a meteor the energy that becomes heat is being converted from the kinetic energy associated with how fast such objects are travelling. When they strike they are travelling at at least the escape velocity of Earth (11200m/s). The amount of kinetic energy they are carrying utterly dwarfs the amount of energy that they absorb in heating up.

The amount of heat it takes to raise the temperature of 1 gram of water by 1K is 4.186 joule;
The amount of heat to raise it from the coldest possible temperature (0K) to boiling (373.15K) is:
4.186 x 373.15 = 1562.0059 J
It goes through a couple of phase changes which take a lot of energy:
From solid to liquid = 334 J
From liquid to vapour = 2260 J
Total energy to vaporise 1g of water at the most (nothing can actually be as cold as 0K and things in our solar system are warmer) is:
1562 + 334 + 2260 = 4156 J

Now let's work through the least energy 1 gram of meteor has due to it's speed. The slowest a meteor can be travelling when striking the earth is close to the exit velocity of earth 11200 m/s. This is the speed you need to be travelling to leave earth's gravity, conversely any object entering earth's gravity is going to be accelerated to this speed as it "falls" in. This is a minimum because on top of this, will be its starting velocity towards the earth which has to be positive or it wouldn't have fallen into our gravity well.
K.E. = ½mv2
K.E. = 0.5x0.001x11200x11200
K.E. = 62720 J

So there you go, each gram of your meteor can absorb at most 4156 joules of energy before vaporising, each gram of your meteor carries with it at least 62720 joules of energy. Plenty enough to vaporise itself and a lot more beside. It doesn't matter how big or small it is, it's always going to bring way more energy than it can absorb.

It doesn't make much difference if the energy is released by friction with atmosphere making a burning hot atmosphere and a massive blast wave, or whether the core gets through (like with your fire hose) and the slow down occurs suddenly by striking the surface creating a massive blast wave and heat in the ground and air and throwing debris into the air. The energy involved and thus the destruction is about the same.

But then, you already know all this, you know it intuitively, you've seen meteors, you've seen the heat and light they produce. So how is it that a charlatan like Hovind suckered you in to believing something that is completely counter to what you already knew to be true?
Tue Feb 25, 2014 1:28 pm
DutchLiam84User avatarPosts: 382Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2010 2:27 pmLocation: Eurasian Plate Gender: Time Lord

Post Re: Questions to Justice Frangi about Noah's flood

I'm confused now, is Justice arguing for the Canopy "Theory" as the cause of the Noachian flood AND an ice meteor (?) as the cause of the Noachian Flood?
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Tue Feb 25, 2014 1:33 pm
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InfernoContributorUser avatarPosts: 2298Joined: Thu Apr 30, 2009 7:36 pmLocation: Vienna, Austria Gender: Cake

Post Re: Questions to Justice Frangi about Noah's flood

DutchLiam84 wrote:I'm confused now, is Justice arguing for the Canopy "Theory" as the cause of the Noachian flood AND an ice meteor (?) as the cause of the Noachian Flood?


EVERYTHING is the cause for the Noachian Flood. Tears, wee, ice meteors... ;)
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Tue Feb 25, 2014 5:58 pm
Justice FrangipaneUser avatarPosts: 42Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 10:39 pm Gender: Male

Post Re: Questions to Justice Frangi about Noah's flood

If you don't mind Ill repeat a few questions here.

What assumptions are used in radiometric dating?

How would you falsify radiometric dating?

What elements filter out or block radiation?
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Thu Feb 27, 2014 8:33 pm
InfernoContributorUser avatarPosts: 2298Joined: Thu Apr 30, 2009 7:36 pmLocation: Vienna, Austria Gender: Cake

Post Re: Questions to Justice Frangi about Noah's flood

Justice Frangipane wrote:If you don't mind Ill repeat a few questions here.

What assumptions are used in radiometric dating?

How would you falsify radiometric dating?

What elements filter out or block radiation?


Answered here.
"Sometimes people don't want to hear the truth because they don't want their illusions destroyed." ― Friedrich Nietzsche

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Thu Feb 27, 2014 9:02 pm
he_who_is_nobodyBloggerUser avatarPosts: 3222Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2009 1:36 amLocation: Albuquerque, New Mexico Gender: Male

Post Re: Questions to Justice Frangi about Noah's flood

Inferno wrote:
Justice Frangipane wrote:If you don't mind Ill repeat a few questions here.

What assumptions are used in radiometric dating?

How would you falsify radiometric dating?

What elements filter out or block radiation?


Answered here.


Well, in fairness, I answered all those except the last one, but I do not see why he is posting those questions on this thread. This thread was created to discuss the flood of Noah. Has he admitted that the flood of Noah did not happen so we can move on to other topics?
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Thu Feb 27, 2014 9:19 pm
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