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How does Incest fit into our society?

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How does Incest fit into our society?
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abelcainsbrotherBannedUser avatarPosts: 774Joined: Wed Jun 04, 2014 6:33 am Gender: Male

Post Re: How does Incest fit into our society?

Inferno wrote:
abelcainsbrother wrote:The truth hurts.I did not say atheists can't sin or kill,or can't do good,we all can but we all have sinned but that is the whole reason for Jesus who died and rose again to save sinners.Atheists have nothing to draw from yet they draw from God all the time when they judge Christians.It is a logical fallacy.


You are so full of shit it's not even funny.
Religious people are typically the last to adopt the new morality other people have put forward: LGBT rights, rights for black people, women's rights, etc. And you dare get all high and mighty? I'm close to disregarding forum rules and cussing you out.







That is your angry opinion but I saw and watched how Christianity corrected things in our society like slavery.Also stop whitewashing the 20th century where atheist rulers slaughtered far more and terrorized for more human lives and than all Christian wars combined and Christian societies.

When atheists are in power a slaughterhouse is what you get.You don't have freedom and you are indoctrinated and held back.

You cannot draw from God to judge Christians like you are doing,because you have nothing to draw from to know what is right or wrong.You cannot borrow morality from God you don't believe in.Christians have a right to stand up for morality though and to stand against sin.Christians care for gay people far more than the people agging them on do and homosexuality leads to death of a society even if you don't think its wrong.

Gay people have short life spans because of diseases and yet people like you don't seem to care.
Mon Mar 30, 2015 10:24 am
InfernoContributorUser avatarPosts: 2298Joined: Thu Apr 30, 2009 7:36 pmLocation: Vienna, Austria Gender: Cake

Post Re: How does Incest fit into our society?

abelcainsbrother wrote:Also stop whitewashing the 20th century where atheist rulers slaughtered far more and terrorized for more human lives and than all Christian wars combined and Christian societies.


I am not "whitewashing", you are simply misinformed.

Hitler was a creationist Christian.

Mao might have been an atheist, but he elevated himself to a god. That's not atheism, that's megalomania.
Stalin might have been an atheist, but he elevated himself to a god. That's not atheism, that's megalomania.
Kim Il-sung might have been an atheist, but he elevated himself to a god. That's not atheism, that's megalomania.

To claim that they killed people because of their atheism is an Orwellian distortion of history.



abelcainsbrother wrote:When atheists are in power a slaughterhouse is what you get.You don't have freedom and you are indoctrinated and held back.


Bullshit and lies, that's all it is.
The very same video I linked to also addresses this statement.

abelcainsbrother wrote:You cannot draw from God to judge Christians like you are doing,because you have nothing to draw from to know what is right or wrong.You cannot borrow morality from God you don't believe in.Christians have a right to stand up for morality though and to stand against sin.Christians care for gay people far more than the people agging them on do and homosexuality leads to death of a society even if you don't think its wrong.

Gay people have short life spans because of diseases and yet people like you don't seem to care.


Just stop talking, you're not doing yourself a favour. I have a few gay friends, two of which are in a long-term committed relationship. No diseases there because... guess what, they're not sleeping around. All they want to do is adopt a kid or two (they'd be excellent parents) but they can't. Why? Because of religion, because of simple- and closed-minded, conservative idiots.

On the other hand we have AIDS. That's spread by every form of unprotected sex, gay or straight. What does the church do? What do religious communities do? Nothing. The only real way to keep it in check is to hand out condoms. Guess who's doing that? Secular societies.
"Sometimes people don't want to hear the truth because they don't want their illusions destroyed." ― Friedrich Nietzsche

"I shall achieve my objectives through the power... of Science!" --LessWrong
Mon Mar 30, 2015 5:57 pm
Master_Ghost_KnightContributorUser avatarPosts: 2630Joined: Sat Feb 21, 2009 11:57 pmLocation: Netherlands Gender: Male

Post Re: How does Incest fit into our society?

abelcainsbrother wrote:You cannot draw from God to judge Christians like you are doing,because you have nothing to draw from to know what is right or wrong.You cannot borrow morality from God you don't believe in.Christians have a right to stand up for morality though and to stand against sin.Christians care for gay people far more than the people agging them on do and homosexuality leads to death of a society even if you don't think its wrong.


Yes or not Question. Do you find any or all of the following wrong?
Slavery.
Rape.
Child molestation.
Child abuse.
Death to people for being gay.
Death to people for working on the wrong day of the week.
"I have an irrefutable argument for the existence of...." NO, STOP! You are already wrong!
Mon Mar 30, 2015 6:53 pm
SpecialFrogUser avatarPosts: 827Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2014 2:13 pmLocation: Great White North Gender: Tree

Post Re: How does Incest fit into our society?

Inferno wrote:Hitler was a creationist Christian.

Mao might have been an atheist, but he elevated himself to a god. That's not atheism, that's megalomania.
Stalin might have been an atheist, but he elevated himself to a god. That's not atheism, that's megalomania.
Kim Il-sung might have been an atheist, but he elevated himself to a god. That's not atheism, that's megalomania.

To claim that they killed people because of their atheism is an Orwellian distortion of history.

While I agree that it makes no sense to attribute Mao or Stalin's actions to "atheism", saying they weren't really atheist is a bit of a "no true Scotsman".

You can have atheist religions, which is really what Maoism and Stalinism were (and North Korea is). As Orwell said, "A totalitarian state is in effect a theocracy."

But I think we can both agree that Abel demonstrates no more about this than he does about evolution.
"Life is nothing but an electron looking for a place to rest" -- Albert Szent-Gyrgyi
Mon Mar 30, 2015 7:05 pm
ldmitrukUser avatarPosts: 221Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2013 2:47 pmLocation: Edmonton, Alberta Gender: Cake

Post Re: How does Incest fit into our society?

SpecialFrog wrote:
Inferno wrote:Hitler was a creationist Christian.

Mao might have been an atheist, but he elevated himself to a god. That's not atheism, that's megalomania.
Stalin might have been an atheist, but he elevated himself to a god. That's not atheism, that's megalomania.
Kim Il-sung might have been an atheist, but he elevated himself to a god. That's not atheism, that's megalomania.

To claim that they killed people because of their atheism is an Orwellian distortion of history.

While I agree that it makes no sense to attribute Mao or Stalin's actions to "atheism", saying they weren't really atheist is a bit of a "no true Scotsman".

You can have atheist religions, which is really what Maoism and Stalinism were (and North Korea is). As Orwell said, "A totalitarian state is in effect a theocracy."

But I think we can both agree that Abel demonstrates no more about this than he does about evolution.


Funny how the Christians never mention the religions of the leaders who started WWI.
Mon Mar 30, 2015 8:13 pm
abelcainsbrotherBannedUser avatarPosts: 774Joined: Wed Jun 04, 2014 6:33 am Gender: Male

Post Re: How does Incest fit into our society?

Judge. For my atheist friends.
https://m.youtube.com/?#/watch?v=tO1GEG4HeRI
Tue Mar 31, 2015 2:22 am
VisakiUser avatarPosts: 677Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2010 12:26 pmLocation: Helsinki, Finland Gender: Male

Post Re: How does Incest fit into our society?

SpecialFrog wrote:
Inferno wrote:Hitler was a creationist Christian.

Mao might have been an atheist, but he elevated himself to a god. That's not atheism, that's megalomania.
Stalin might have been an atheist, but he elevated himself to a god. That's not atheism, that's megalomania.
Kim Il-sung might have been an atheist, but he elevated himself to a god. That's not atheism, that's megalomania.

To claim that they killed people because of their atheism is an Orwellian distortion of history.

While I agree that it makes no sense to attribute Mao or Stalin's actions to "atheism", saying they weren't really atheist is a bit of a "no true Scotsman".

You can have atheist religions, which is really what Maoism and Stalinism were (and North Korea is). As Orwell said, "A totalitarian state is in effect a theocracy."

But I think we can both agree that Abel demonstrates no more about this than he does about evolution.

Mao and Stalin were atheist, or at least very probably they were. Kim Il-Sung wasn't really since he really did think of himself as a god, making him perhaps a autotheist. The broader point is this though; for actions they did they were inspired, like most people, by an ideology. Atheism isn't a ideology, it's merely a lack of belief in the existance of one or more deities, and thus can't inspire action (logically speaking). Has anyone heard of something being done in the name of atheism that made sense with the correct defenition of atheism? Jeffry Dahmer claimed to have done his deeds partly because God doesn't exist, but then again he was a cannibalistic necrofilic murderer with, shall we say, not the strongest grip on reality.

In other words saying that Stalin, Mao and Kim did what they did because of atheism is much like saying that Hitler had all those people killed because he had a mustache. It's a non sequitur.

One last thing; believers usually forget that what they believe is also an ideology, just one with a supernatural dimension. Other than it's supernaturatility it isn't somehow special among ideologies.
Tue Mar 31, 2015 11:29 am
InfernoContributorUser avatarPosts: 2298Joined: Thu Apr 30, 2009 7:36 pmLocation: Vienna, Austria Gender: Cake

Post Re: How does Incest fit into our society?

SpecialFrog wrote:
Inferno wrote:Hitler was a creationist Christian.

Mao might have been an atheist, but he elevated himself to a god. That's not atheism, that's megalomania.
Stalin might have been an atheist, but he elevated himself to a god. That's not atheism, that's megalomania.
Kim Il-sung might have been an atheist, but he elevated himself to a god. That's not atheism, that's megalomania.

To claim that they killed people because of their atheism is an Orwellian distortion of history.

While I agree that it makes no sense to attribute Mao or Stalin's actions to "atheism", saying they weren't really atheist is a bit of a "no true Scotsman".

You can have atheist religions, which is really what Maoism and Stalinism were (and North Korea is). As Orwell said, "A totalitarian state is in effect a theocracy."

But I think we can both agree that Abel demonstrates no more about this than he does about evolution.


I don't think I said that they "weren't really atheists". They might well have been atheists privately, I have no problem with that. But their form of government was anything but an atheist state.
"Sometimes people don't want to hear the truth because they don't want their illusions destroyed." ― Friedrich Nietzsche

"I shall achieve my objectives through the power... of Science!" --LessWrong
Tue Mar 31, 2015 3:07 pm
SpecialFrogUser avatarPosts: 827Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2014 2:13 pmLocation: Great White North Gender: Tree

Post Re: How does Incest fit into our society?

Inferno wrote:I don't think I said that they "weren't really atheists". They might well have been atheists privately, I have no problem with that. But their form of government was anything but an atheist state.

I interpreted, "that's not atheism, that's megalomania" as at least an implication that they weren't "real" atheists.

I accept that was not your intent and I agree that their atheism is largely meaningless in this context.

However, I think you can call Stalinist Russia an "atheist state" while arguing that it was still a theocracy. Religion doesn't require a belief in gods and atheism doesn't require rationality, empiricism or humanism.
"Life is nothing but an electron looking for a place to rest" -- Albert Szent-Gyrgyi
Tue Mar 31, 2015 5:00 pm
ldmitrukUser avatarPosts: 221Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2013 2:47 pmLocation: Edmonton, Alberta Gender: Cake

Post Re: How does Incest fit into our society?

SpecialFrog wrote:
Inferno wrote:I don't think I said that they "weren't really atheists". They might well have been atheists privately, I have no problem with that. But their form of government was anything but an atheist state.

I interpreted, "that's not atheism, that's megalomania" as at least an implication that they weren't "real" atheists.

I accept that was not your intent and I agree that their atheism is largely meaningless in this context.

However, I think you can call Stalinist Russia an "atheist state" while arguing that it was still a theocracy. Religion doesn't require a belief in gods and atheism doesn't require rationality, empiricism or humanism.



If a person wants to get really picky Stalin and Mao established cults of personality. In checking this out on the ever totally correct Wikipedia cults of personality are similar to divinization and can lead to the development of political religion. It's interesting in political religions try to replace or get rid of other religions. So your statement indicating Stalinist Russia was a theocracy is correct and I think we can safely say the same about Germany under Hitler, North Korea, and China under Mao.
Tue Mar 31, 2015 5:24 pm
InfernoContributorUser avatarPosts: 2298Joined: Thu Apr 30, 2009 7:36 pmLocation: Vienna, Austria Gender: Cake

Post Re: How does Incest fit into our society?

SpecialFrog wrote:I interpreted, "that's not atheism, that's megalomania" as at least an implication that they weren't "real" atheists.

I accept that was not your intent and I agree that their atheism is largely meaningless in this context.

However, I think you can call Stalinist Russia an "atheist state" while arguing that it was still a theocracy. Religion doesn't require a belief in gods and atheism doesn't require rationality, empiricism or humanism.


Hitchens made the point that, though sometimes called a nominally atheist state, is perhaps the most religious country in the world. Replacing "God" with "the holy Kim Il-sung" is not atheism. The same holds true for Stalin's Russia, Mao's China and for Hitler's 3rd Reich. In all four countries, miracles are/were attributed to the people and they are sometimes claimed to have survived their death. How is that not religion?
"Sometimes people don't want to hear the truth because they don't want their illusions destroyed." ― Friedrich Nietzsche

"I shall achieve my objectives through the power... of Science!" --LessWrong
Tue Mar 31, 2015 6:30 pm
SpecialFrogUser avatarPosts: 827Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2014 2:13 pmLocation: Great White North Gender: Tree

Post Re: How does Incest fit into our society?

Inferno wrote:
SpecialFrog wrote:I interpreted, "that's not atheism, that's megalomania" as at least an implication that they weren't "real" atheists.

I accept that was not your intent and I agree that their atheism is largely meaningless in this context.

However, I think you can call Stalinist Russia an "atheist state" while arguing that it was still a theocracy. Religion doesn't require a belief in gods and atheism doesn't require rationality, empiricism or humanism.


Hitchens made the point that, though sometimes called a nominally atheist state, is perhaps the most religious country in the world. Replacing "God" with "the holy Kim Il-sung" is not atheism. The same holds true for Stalin's Russia, Mao's China and for Hitler's 3rd Reich. In all four countries, miracles are/were attributed to the people and they are sometimes claimed to have survived their death. How is that not religion?


I agree with ldmitruk's comments above.

I also never said it was "not religion" and in fact called it "atheist religion". Atheism is the lack of belief in gods, not the lack of religion. I would argue that Objectivism is a quasi-religion. :)

Also, I think North Korea is kind of a different category from Russia / China in that while Stalin and Mao certainly had a "cult of personality" going, Kim Il-Sung was perhaps more literally deified.

I don't think we are really disagreeing with each other here except possibly on terminology.
"Life is nothing but an electron looking for a place to rest" -- Albert Szent-Gyrgyi
Tue Mar 31, 2015 6:47 pm
tuxboxLeague LegendUser avatarPosts: 1172Joined: Sun Oct 30, 2011 7:05 amLocation: Vero Beach Gender: Tree

Post Re: How does Incest fit into our society?

My great great grandparents were cousins, and just about everyone of my current family members, including myself, suffer from some form of mental illness. I don't know if that caused our mental illness but it is imo it is something that can't be overlooked. That said, I don't think any government should sick their noses in the private lives of consenting adults.
"Belief in a cruel God makes a cruel man." ~ Thomas Paine
Tue Mar 31, 2015 11:46 pm
ldmitrukUser avatarPosts: 221Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2013 2:47 pmLocation: Edmonton, Alberta Gender: Cake

Post Re: How does Incest fit into our society?

tuxbox wrote:My great great grandparents were cousins, and just about everyone of my current family members, including myself, suffer from some form of mental illness. I don't know if that caused our mental illness but it is imo it is something that can't be overlooked. That said, I don't think any government should sick their noses in the private lives of consenting adults.


There's also all the health problems marrying within families caused the royalty. So I would agree in your case it's not something to overlook.
Wed Apr 01, 2015 4:27 am
abelcainsbrotherBannedUser avatarPosts: 774Joined: Wed Jun 04, 2014 6:33 am Gender: Male

Post Re: How does Incest fit into our society?

Look at everybody whitewashing what atheists do and making excuses,they want to explain away what atheist leaders have done yet condemn Christian societies that gave them the freedom to choose their path in life.It seems atheists want the freedoms Christianity gave them but not the God that gave them freedom in the west.
Wed Apr 01, 2015 11:29 am
VisakiUser avatarPosts: 677Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2010 12:26 pmLocation: Helsinki, Finland Gender: Male

Post Re: How does Incest fit into our society?

abelcainsbrother wrote:Look at everybody whitewashing what atheists do and making excuses,they want to explain away what atheist leaders have done yet condemn Christian societies that gave them the freedom to choose their path in life.It seems atheists want the freedoms Christianity gave them but not the God that gave them freedom in the west.

And just what freedoms did christianity exactly give me?
Wed Apr 01, 2015 1:28 pm
ldmitrukUser avatarPosts: 221Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2013 2:47 pmLocation: Edmonton, Alberta Gender: Cake

Post Re: How does Incest fit into our society?

Visaki wrote:
abelcainsbrother wrote:Look at everybody whitewashing what atheists do and making excuses,they want to explain away what atheist leaders have done yet condemn Christian societies that gave them the freedom to choose their path in life.It seems atheists want the freedoms Christianity gave them but not the God that gave them freedom in the west.

And just what freedoms did christianity exactly give me?


Lets compile a list. Off the top of my head:

Freedom to own slaves
Freedom to commit genocide
Freedom to obey god
Freedom to not question god
Freedom to discriminate

:lol:
Wed Apr 01, 2015 5:19 pm
ldmitrukUser avatarPosts: 221Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2013 2:47 pmLocation: Edmonton, Alberta Gender: Cake

Post Re: How does Incest fit into our society?

abelcainsbrother wrote:Look at everybody whitewashing what atheists do and making excuses,they want to explain away what atheist leaders have done yet condemn Christian societies that gave them the freedom to choose their path in life.It seems atheists want the freedoms Christianity gave them but not the God that gave them freedom in the west.


What a joke. the god of the bible wants people to be subservient to obey him without questioning.
Wed Apr 01, 2015 5:28 pm
ldmitrukUser avatarPosts: 221Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2013 2:47 pmLocation: Edmonton, Alberta Gender: Cake

Post Re: How does Incest fit into our society?

abelcainsbrother wrote:Look at everybody whitewashing what atheists do and making excuses,they want to explain away what atheist leaders have done yet condemn Christian societies that gave them the freedom to choose their path in life.It seems atheists want the freedoms Christianity gave them but not the God that gave them freedom in the west.



I think Brain Dalton's video is a good response to the freedom you say Christianity gave to the west.

Thu Apr 02, 2015 3:56 am
abelcainsbrotherBannedUser avatarPosts: 774Joined: Wed Jun 04, 2014 6:33 am Gender: Male

Post Re: How does Incest fit into our society?

ldmitruk wrote:
abelcainsbrother wrote:Look at everybody whitewashing what atheists do and making excuses,they want to explain away what atheist leaders have done yet condemn Christian societies that gave them the freedom to choose their path in life.It seems atheists want the freedoms Christianity gave them but not the God that gave them freedom in the west.



I think Brain Dalton's video is a good response to the freedom you say Christianity gave to the west.



He is ignoring what atheists leaders do when they are in power,just like you are.Compare fairly in the west you have had the freedom to do and be whatever you choose.
Thu Apr 02, 2015 6:38 am
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