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A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know

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A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know
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Gendou_AugustusPosts: 25Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2018 1:33 am Gender: Time Lord

Post A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know

I'm not sure where to put this, but i'll do it anyway. I'm fairly certain that some of the people here, know someone with some rather odd beliefs. You can believe whatever you like; no one really cares what you believe just why you believe. What are your reasons, evidence, etc. You don't have to defend your beliefs either. But if you say your beliefs represent something that is part of objective reality and you want others to believe as you do, then you do have to provide evidence and facts for your beliefs. If you dont, you will fail. I'm not gonna give out any names or anything personal. I don't want to start a shitstorm or a doxxing match. Anyhow, here's the list:

That he’s special

Dragons

Magic

Harry Potter

Ghosts

Elvis never died/faked his death

Michael Jackson faked his death

Non-avian dinosaurs never went extinct and that birds are not dinosaurs

Superheroes and that he is one


Spells and he can cast them

Cruses and he can place them on others

Transformation; he thinks he can transform into, say a T-rex, velociraptor, etc

Power Rangers and that he is one

Half human, half alien beings and he's one of them; "I'm not from this world."

Were-Animals and that he can transform into one, such as a werewolf

Human Genetic Modification

Spirit Animals, such as the spirit of the T-rex, wolf, panther, etc

Super Intelligence; "I'm smarter than you humans"

Super Strength; "I'm stronger than you" (All without proof or evidence of any kind)

Skylanders

Monsters

An afterlife

That he is sent from God

That atheists just hate god, are jealous of god, his creation, etc

That atheists are bad people and they can’t be good (Thinks it’s a lie.)

Belief is equal to knowledge

Everything he believes in is not a hoax (Special pleading)

Demons and that he will fight them

Angels

Digimon; "Respect my Digimon!"

Pokemon

Dimensional Travel and Dimensions

Time Travel

Doctor Who; he believes in him, he thinks he’s a real person and has seen him since early childhood.
Not to mention he thinks he saw my future. It's full of hate, apparently.
Also thinks I need to believe in him.

Immortality

Anything his father says

Dimensional Agelessness; he only ages in this one, he says

Dimensional Forms and that this one is just his "earth form" or whatever

Potions

Human vs immortals dichotomy

Apocalypse of mankind; zombie ones, mostly. I hear him talking about it on the bus with his friend.
That and his comments about it, such as “There is no hope for you humans."
and "The world will end in August 2018."

Absolute power; "I can do anything I want."

Alchemy

Immortal Science

Creationism; "Who created the world? God did." (Despite the fact that it's not a who, but a
what.)

That most criticisms of what he believes in are the result of jealousy or some other emotion (bulverism)
"

Some other misc stuff that is likely important.

This is what he thinks others should believe in:
God; “He knows you.” “He loves you.”
Superheros
Doctor Who; “He knows your future.”

This is what he does when others press him for evidence:
Shifts burdens of proof; "That's what you need to find out."

Ad hoc; "It's all top secret." "I can't because of my x or y law." "Why do you need evidence?
Mon Jul 02, 2018 1:49 am
SparhafocPosts: 2434Joined: Fri Jun 23, 2017 6:48 am

Post Re: A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know

It only stands to reason, really.

If someone is so devoid of critical thinking or rationality that they're ready to lend belief to one quantum of hokum, then it naturally follows that they're just as susceptible to other bollocks too.

If you want an approach with him to explain your position, tell him you're not interested in what can be said, only what can be shown to be true. Then ask him how you might be able to test any of these to see whether they hold up to scrutiny.

When he can't, then at least he has a glimmer as to why you don't lend his belief credulity.

Whatever the case, he sounds like a kid, and he'll grow up and possibly change his position drastically.
"a reprehensible human being"
Beliefs are, by definition, things we don't know to be true.
Mon Jul 02, 2018 12:07 pm
Master_Ghost_KnightContributorUser avatar
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Posts: 2719Joined: Sat Feb 21, 2009 11:57 pmLocation: Netherlands Gender: Male

Post Re: A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know

Power Rangers?

How old is he?
"I have an irrefutable argument for the existence of...." NO, STOP! You are already wrong!
Mon Jul 02, 2018 12:12 pm
*SD*User avatarPosts: 287Joined: Sat Mar 30, 2013 1:00 amLocation: Wales, UK Gender: Male

Post Re: A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know

Is there anything he doesn't believe in?!

I was at a BBQ yesterday and we were talking about water shortage etc, then the conversation moved to wells and natural springs (I live rural) and from there someone brought up water divining. It's sometimes called dowsing (I think). A few of us, me included immediately knee jerked with 'bunk, it doesn't work' and were met with insistence along the lines of 'that's what I thought, but then I tried it and it totally works'

I remember being intrigued by this a few years ago so I did a bit of research. I seem to remember it being debunked thoroughly by the JREF, and some other sources. But I haven't done any recent research so I will revisit the subject. Many report great success in doing this, in fact, there are companies who do nothing but offer this 'service' and they are employed by other companies, such as bore-holers for example to 'find' the water before work beings. Keeping in mind many bore holes are hundreds, even thousands of feet down before hitting the drink I'm not sure what property water would have, especially this far down, that would cause glorified coat hangers to wiggle around.

But as I said, I'll revisit the topic before shooting my mouth off too loudly.
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Mon Jul 02, 2018 1:31 pm
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*SD*User avatarPosts: 287Joined: Sat Mar 30, 2013 1:00 amLocation: Wales, UK Gender: Male

Post Re: A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know

Master_Ghost_Knight wrote:Power Rangers?


That's just silly. Everyone knows the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles wiped the Power Rangers out years ago :)
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Mon Jul 02, 2018 1:32 pm
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SparhafocPosts: 2434Joined: Fri Jun 23, 2017 6:48 am

Post Re: A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know

*SD* wrote:Is there anything he doesn't believe in?!

I was at a BBQ yesterday and we were talking about water shortage etc, then the conversation moved to wells and natural springs (I live rural) and from there someone brought up water divining. It's sometimes called dowsing (I think). A few of us, me included immediately knee jerked with 'bunk, it doesn't work' and were met with insistence along the lines of 'that's what I thought, but then I tried it and it totally works'

I remember being intrigued by this a few years ago so I did a bit of research. I seem to remember it being debunked thoroughly by the JREF, and some other sources. But I haven't done any recent research so I will revisit the subject. Many report great success in doing this, in fact, there are companies who do nothing but offer this 'service' and they are employed by other companies, such as bore-holers for example to 'find' the water before work beings. Keeping in mind many bore holes are hundreds, even thousands of feet down before hitting the drink I'm not sure what property water would have, especially this far down, that would cause glorified coat hangers to wiggle around.

But as I said, I'll revisit the topic before shooting my mouth off too loudly.



There's nearly always water below if you're prepared to dig deep enough! :)

Trial after test after experiment has shown that there's no greater in accuracy statistically via professional dowsers than just randomly pointing at a stretch of ground and shouting eureka.
"a reprehensible human being"
Beliefs are, by definition, things we don't know to be true.
Mon Jul 02, 2018 5:40 pm
Gendou_AugustusPosts: 25Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2018 1:33 am Gender: Time Lord

Post Re: A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know

Master_Ghost_Knight wrote:Power Rangers?

How old is he?


About 19.
Mon Jul 02, 2018 6:09 pm
Gendou_AugustusPosts: 25Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2018 1:33 am Gender: Time Lord

Post Re: A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know

Sparhafoc wrote:It only stands to reason, really.

If someone is so devoid of critical thinking or rationality that they're ready to lend belief to one quantum of hokum, then it naturally follows that they're just as susceptible to other bollocks too.

If you want an approach with him to explain your position, tell him you're not interested in what can be said, only what can be shown to be true. Then ask him how you might be able to test any of these to see whether they hold up to scrutiny.

When he can't, then at least he has a glimmer as to why you don't lend his belief credulity.

Whatever the case, he sounds like a kid, and he'll grow up and possibly change his position drastically.


The problem is that, while he may not be a kid, he definitely thinks like one. He practices willful ignorance all the time and tries to scare me. He utterly ignores all my points. Every time I try to get him to bring me evidencie, he dismisses it with ad hoc excuses. "I can't do that because of my superhero law." "That's what you need to find out." "It's complicated.", "Why do you need evidence?", etc. It seems, to him, that you don't need evidence. Apparently if someone says it on youtube it's true.
Last edited by Gendou_Augustus on Mon Jul 02, 2018 8:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Mon Jul 02, 2018 6:16 pm
psikhrangkurPosts: 114Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2018 3:30 pm Gender: Pinecone

Post Re: A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know

Have you tried telling them that they act like a prick?
Mon Jul 02, 2018 8:17 pm
Gendou_AugustusPosts: 25Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2018 1:33 am Gender: Time Lord

Post Re: A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know

He has this smug look on his face everytime I met him. He's a really elitist about music too. Apparently, one should only listen to 80's and christian music, otherwise, you bad. This is super childish, but not surprising at all. It seems that he can't tell subjective things from objective things. One time I asked for evidence and proof of his claims, he directed me to this youtube channel.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC5cNkY ... ZxP51_vmLw
(He thinks youtube is reliable for evidence of his claims)

And these, likely
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCUVa51 ... EKyRbHb-5A
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCHKdYR ... 53APbUDxyw
Mon Jul 02, 2018 8:49 pm
SparhafocPosts: 2434Joined: Fri Jun 23, 2017 6:48 am

Post Re: A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know

Gendou_Augustus wrote:
Sparhafoc wrote:It only stands to reason, really.

If someone is so devoid of critical thinking or rationality that they're ready to lend belief to one quantum of hokum, then it naturally follows that they're just as susceptible to other bollocks too.

If you want an approach with him to explain your position, tell him you're not interested in what can be said, only what can be shown to be true. Then ask him how you might be able to test any of these to see whether they hold up to scrutiny.

When he can't, then at least he has a glimmer as to why you don't lend his belief credulity.

Whatever the case, he sounds like a kid, and he'll grow up and possibly change his position drastically.


The problem is that, while he may not be a kid, he definitely thinks like one. He practices willful ignorance all the time and tries to scare me. He utterly ignores all my points. Every time I try to get him to bring me evidencie, he dismisses it with ad hoc excuses. "I can't do that because of my superhero law." "That's what you need to find out." "It's complicated.", "Why do you need evidence?", etc. It seems, to him, that you don't need evidence. Apparently if someone says it on youtube it's true.



Hmm, he may be 19, but he sounds very much like a kid to me.

Honestly, I wouldn't bother with him. Too deluded. Let him be and spend your time on something more fruitful! ;)
"a reprehensible human being"
Beliefs are, by definition, things we don't know to be true.
Mon Jul 02, 2018 9:35 pm
Master_Ghost_KnightContributorUser avatar
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Post Re: A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know

Gendou_Augustus wrote:
Master_Ghost_Knight wrote:Power Rangers?

How old is he?


About 19.

Does he have a mental disability?
"I have an irrefutable argument for the existence of...." NO, STOP! You are already wrong!
Tue Jul 03, 2018 7:29 am
Gendou_AugustusPosts: 25Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2018 1:33 am Gender: Time Lord

Post Re: A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know

Yes. ASD, to be exact.
Tue Jul 03, 2018 8:39 am
Master_Ghost_KnightContributorUser avatar
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Post Re: A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know

Gendou_Augustus wrote:Yes. ASD, to be exact.

Acute Stress Disorder?
"I have an irrefutable argument for the existence of...." NO, STOP! You are already wrong!
Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:15 am
SparhafocPosts: 2434Joined: Fri Jun 23, 2017 6:48 am

Post Re: A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know

Austistic Spectrum Disorder... and consequently, a lot of the above is no surprise, particularly if it's Asperger's.

It's really best just to let the guy be - he's got enough on his plate already, and if beliefs like the above give him some semblance of control over his own life, then good for him. Any which way, arguing with someone suffering from ASD is not going to have a beneficial outcome regardless.
"a reprehensible human being"
Beliefs are, by definition, things we don't know to be true.
Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:35 am
SparhafocPosts: 2434Joined: Fri Jun 23, 2017 6:48 am

Post Re: A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know

Gendou_Augustus wrote:He has this smug look on his face everytime I met him.


One of the factors of ASD is a lack of social awareness and extremely poor communication, both verbal and behavioral. He might have learned to smile, but it may read as 'smug'.


Gendou_Augustus wrote:He's a really elitist about music too. Apparently, one should only listen to 80's and christian music, otherwise, you bad.


Particularly with Asperger's, there is a suite of obsessive compulsive behaviors where sufferers fixate on particular routines, themes, styles etc. I remember watching a guy who loved the Victorian era and surrounded himself with memorabilia, dressed in antique suits, and generally only felt comfortable when surrounded by the familiar world he'd created.


Gendou_Augustus wrote: This is super childish, but not surprising at all.


If he's genuinely diagnosed with ASD (and it does sound like it), it's part of the disorder he's suffering from. Kids with Asperger's often end up playing with younger kids with whom they feel more comfortable. Such people suffer from slow social development, so he's probably unaware that he's acting like someone years younger than he 'should' be. He's probably quite cool for his respective younger age group.


Gendou_Augustus wrote: It seems that he can't tell subjective things from objective things. One time I asked for evidence and proof of his claims, he directed me to this youtube channel.


Yeah, this all adds up. I think there's more room for compassion here than for skepticism. He lacks the cognitive tools to engage in skepticism of his ideas, he lacks the social development to contend with your challenges, he lacks verbal command to offer anything but these declarations that seem infantile; he's made a world in which he is central and feels more in control of his life. It's his crutch, and considering he's suffering from a genuine and debilitating illness, I think one would need a very good reason to try and kick it out from under him.
"a reprehensible human being"
Beliefs are, by definition, things we don't know to be true.
Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:47 am
Gendou_AugustusPosts: 25Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2018 1:33 am Gender: Time Lord

Post Re: A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know

Yeah, this all adds up. I think there's more room for compassion here than for skepticism. He lacks the cognitive tools to engage in skepticism of his ideas, he lacks the social development to contend with your challenges, he lacks verbal command to offer anything but these declarations that seem infantile; he's made a world in which he is central and feels more in control of his life. It's his crutch, and considering he's suffering from a genuine and debilitating illness, I think one would need a very good reason to try and kick it out from under him.


I believe he didn't really get the same treatment I did. Or he grew up in more stricter household. I grew up one the internet. I heard and met a lot of beliefs over the ages, I used to be a conspiracy theorist growing up and then I became a marxist after that. Then I got out of that via reading over arguments with ancaps, etc. I think the reason I argued with him so much is that I used to be like him. A smug know it all that knows the truth of reality. Whether it be the Illuminati, NWO, the system or even supervillains from fiction, I knew what was really going one back then.

I developed my skepticism from my times as a conspiracy theorist and I developed my atheism over time via arguments with theists and became an gnostic atheist, at least towards gods that are impossible. He didn't have the intellectual luxury I had. He grew up with a pastor and creationist father, who discouraged critical thought and skepticism. He made faith and belief to the most important aspect of his life. So it's no real surprise that his son would believe such anti-reality magical nonsense.
Tue Jul 03, 2018 6:51 pm
Master_Ghost_KnightContributorUser avatar
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Post Re: A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know

I think you need to cut some slack, be a bit more understanding than combative.
The guy has very likely a mental disability, and his parent aren't helping the situation.

Maybe you should try to be his friend instead of seeing him as a foe to defeat.
Be a role model that he can look up too. You will find that you will be allot more persuasive this way.
"I have an irrefutable argument for the existence of...." NO, STOP! You are already wrong!
Tue Jul 03, 2018 8:41 pm
he_who_is_nobodyBloggerUser avatarPosts: 3468Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2009 1:36 amLocation: Albuquerque, New Mexico Gender: Male

Post Re: A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know

*SD* wrote:Is there anything he doesn't believe in?!

I was at a BBQ yesterday and we were talking about water shortage etc, then the conversation moved to wells and natural springs (I live rural) and from there someone brought up water divining. It's sometimes called dowsing (I think). A few of us, me included immediately knee jerked with 'bunk, it doesn't work' and were met with insistence along the lines of 'that's what I thought, but then I tried it and it totally works'

I remember being intrigued by this a few years ago so I did a bit of research. I seem to remember it being debunked thoroughly by the JREF, and some other sources. But I haven't done any recent research so I will revisit the subject. Many report great success in doing this, in fact, there are companies who do nothing but offer this 'service' and they are employed by other companies, such as bore-holers for example to 'find' the water before work beings. Keeping in mind many bore holes are hundreds, even thousands of feet down before hitting the drink I'm not sure what property water would have, especially this far down, that would cause glorified coat hangers to wiggle around.

But as I said, I'll revisit the topic before shooting my mouth off too loudly.


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(_.--------------------._)
Tue Jul 03, 2018 9:42 pm
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Gendou_AugustusPosts: 25Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2018 1:33 am Gender: Time Lord

Post Re: A (Now Not So) Personal Thing: A kooky believer I know

Master_Ghost_Knight wrote:I think you need to cut some slack, be a bit more understanding than combative.
The guy has very likely a mental disability, and his parent aren't helping the situation.

Maybe you should try to be his friend instead of seeing him as a foe to defeat.
Be a role model that he can look up too. You will find that you will be allot more persuasive this way.


I have ASD as well. My brother has aspergers and I likely have it too. He's a dick. an alcoholic, has self-pity and is rumatates a lot. He has a low sense of self-esteem, self-worth and self-actualization. My acquaintance, on the other hand, is thinks too highly of himself, has an over exaggerated sense of self-worth, to the point of egotism and has an supreme sense of self-actualization.
Sun Jul 08, 2018 3:40 am
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